home - to The Greyhound-Database
Home  |  Dog-Search  |  Tattoo  |  Races  |  Race Cards  |  Coursing  |  Tracks  |  Statistic  |  Testmating  |                SHOP-UK / IE / AU / DEFacebook
Login  |    |  add_race  |  add_coursing  |  add_dog  |  Membership  |  Ask the Vet  |  Newsletter    Help  print pedigree    
Active-Sires  |  Sire-Pages  |  Classifieds  |  Kennels  |  Photos  |  Videos  |  Library  |  Adoption  |  Forum  |  Links  |  About_us  |  Site Usage

Welcome to the Greyhound Knowledge Forum

Sponsored by:- Rapidvite
This forum is for lovers of the wonderful Greyhound, racing or retired to get help each other with information
to certain Greyhound related topics. Greyhound-Data reserve the right to remove of post that are of-topic,
advertisements or opinions they consider to be offensive or libelless nature. Please read the forum usage manual.


All TopicsGD-WebsiteBreedingHealthRacingCoursingAdoptionBettingTalkLogin to post
Do you have questions about breeding theories?
Or do you need tips on how to rear your pups?

Cosmic Rumblepage  1 2 3 4 5 6 

Brian Williamson
Australia
(Needs Verification)
Posts 257
Dogs 11 / Races 31

16 Mar 2010 03:34


Notice some breeders already standing in line for stud services. It would appear to me that his sire SPIRAL NIKITA has never yet produced a sire that has itself produced any thing of note.A good sire of broods. The jury would still have to be out on his ability to produce a good stud dog every one relying now on the outcross to work.


Sandro Bechini
Australia
(Team Member)
Posts 14709
Dogs 7,826 / Races 822

16 Mar 2010 07:13


Late Late Show produced a pretty good dog called Dazzler


Daryl Annells
Australia
(Needs Verification)
Posts 4706
Dogs 1 / Races 0

16 Mar 2010 20:12


hi brian,
i certainly was a big fan of COSMIC RUMBLE early in his career....not so sure now, but thats based purely on his inability to produce on the track what we ALL require...plenty of good class wins to support his stud career.

my main reason in possibly using him, was to not go all out 100% for an untapped irish import, but to have a split in his breeding where the breeder of the dog had done the outcross for me. without being a smart arse and 'knocking' the imports (irish or american) there are not many choices apart from PREMIER FANTASY or KIOWA SWEET TREY who at least gave us a look at the type of stock ability wise, they would sire....the rest, save my verdicts.

in horse racing (obviously different) breeders would use an un performed stallion purely on his majestic breeding background....sons of.....but in dogs we place more emphasis on PERFORMANCE on the track and the class of those races, more than the dogs breeding background.

so if a dog is well bred like COSMIC RUMBLE, he has to do everything right on the track, before he will be accepted, as we are very tough on our assessments of dogs here, and breeding, while important when he first started winning, suddenly gets categorised when his sire (spiral nakita) or himself does not reach the expectations of breeders.

there are so many others in this CATEGORISED module who are damned as soon as they dont reach the lofty heights WE expect of them....but the shrewd breeder who sees what he wants and goes and does it, takes no interest in the judgements of others....he/she sees what as a breeder they are trying to acheive when breeding with the dam, and do it...regardless.

to me , thats a good breeder, a breeder who assesses a match, not what he did or didnt do on the track, and he must have done something to attract there attention in the first place.
an dont forget, severe injuries will hamper a dogs performance drastically, and unless your right in the kennel no how, we dont often get to hear whats caused this dog to not reach the heights we expected.
it happens.

he will be a good stud i beleive, and he will be well marketed to attract matrons, so i wont matter to him or his stud master....if people want him they will use him.thats a given.

daz


David Brasch
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 645
Dogs 1,151 / Races 5,135

16 Mar 2010 22:54


I believe Cosmic Rumble has a fantastic opportunity for stud success.
Just look at his pedigree.
CLICK HERE
I don't believe Spiral Nikita (or I hope at least) will have much influence on his ability to become a stud success.
The fact Cosmic Rumble is out of a daughter of Brett Lee is his first HUGE plus.
This allows some judicious linebreeding to Wee Sal, Sobbing Sal and could even open up granddaughters of Big Daddy Cool.
Add to that the established nick Brett Lee has with Bobniak.
Something like this.
CLICK HERE
This will also open up also the suitability of bitches by Pure Octane going to Cosmic Rumble. (Many of the best progeny of Pure Octane are out of Brett Lee bitches).
Something like this:
CLICK HERE
The fact Cosmic Rumble carries Malawi's Prince through a daughter also allows a duplication of Malawi's Prince. This can come through Pure Octance, Black Enforcer or any of the lines that carry Malawi's Prince i.e Bombastic Shiraz etc etc.
Something like this.
CLICK HERE
The fact Brett Lee has New Tears as his damsire, also brings in the chances of bitches with SONS of New Tears to be mated to Cosmic Rumble (ie Light Of Fire, Awesome Assassin, Collision etc).
Something like this.
CLICK HERE
Collision in particular will be an interesting match with Cosmic Rumble.
Something like this:
CLICK HERE
The fact Cosmic Rumble has an important DAUGHTER strain of Brother Fox in his damline, and only one SON strain, allows him to mate bitches that are saturated with Brother Fox through sons.
Something like this.
CLICK HERE
So you see, Cosmic Rumble has a fabulous pedigree to suit so many, many, many broodbitches in this country.
That is the opportunity for him to succeed at stud.
Many of the stud dogs who retire don't have this opportunity.

Cosmic Rumble's sire Spiral Nikita is an outcross and a source of hybrid vigor.
His influence within this pedigree will come through Cosmic Rumble's sisters, but they too need to be linebred and in-bred to the best parts of their damline i.e. Gun Law Osti, Sobbing Sal/Wee Sal, Malawi's Prince and further instances of Brother Fox and his half brother Acacia Park.



Attila Sofran
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 472
Dogs 8 / Races 0

16 Mar 2010 23:22


Dave, six months or so a go i had my eyes set on this bloke and when D Mac got a hold of him a started rubbing my hands together. But he's been a little disapointing when he runs against top quality dogs. If he can find his form again in the top gun and run close to his PB people will find confidence in this dog again to stand at stud. And as you say he has alot going for him in his breeding.

When my bitch comes on season again i'm thinking of something like this.
CLICK HERE or
CLICK HERE
cheers attila


David Brasch
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 645
Dogs 1,151 / Races 5,135

16 Mar 2010 23:40


I believe Cosmic Rumble has already proven himself as a source of sensational speed.
He's a feature race winner, who has run exceptionally fast times wherever he goes, and has raced and beaten the best

This wasn't a bad victory

CLICK HERE
and this was pretty slick as well

CLICK HERE
He's also run a track record at Lismore

He does have a habit of being slightly slow to begin which in the best grade can come against him
That I don't believe is a genetic trait

Brett Lee was a flying machine from the lids
so was El Galo
not all of Brett Lee's progeny were flying machines from the lids, in fact very few
Not all El Galo's progeny will have that same trait

It is the huge genetic influence of Cosmic Rumble's damline that will make him a success at stud (give the right opportunities)



Attila Sofran
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 472
Dogs 8 / Races 0

17 Mar 2010 00:21


I was sandown that night but since then just got off the boil a bit but i'm not knocking the dog as i am a fan of him. Might be the quaddie's he cost me lol. and the reason i liked from the start is that SN with BL dam line has worked past so i thought double up on BL with a Spril dog and pray to the heavens.
cheers attila


Daryl Annells
Australia
(Needs Verification)
Posts 4706
Dogs 1 / Races 0

17 Mar 2010 01:11


attila,
thats exactly the reason why i was considering him....that beautiful double up of BRETT LEE.
cant get enough of a super dog like him, and if it works for MALAWIS PRINCE,BROTHER FOX, ETC ETC ETC, then why not the greatest dog we have seen for many a year.
stick with him mate,and if your in a position to at least try it with COSMIC RUMBLE, then dont hesitate.
daz


Jeff Holland
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 4831
Dogs 125 / Races 12

17 Mar 2010 01:27


The question you have to ask is 'has any sire succeeded where his breeding his a bigger attribute than his ability?.'


Edward (ted) Howard
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 504
Dogs 9 / Races 0

17 Mar 2010 01:47


Im not sure but wasnt Rocker Mac just a reasonable racedog. Cheers Ted


Attila Sofran
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 472
Dogs 8 / Races 0

17 Mar 2010 01:50


When he stands at stud what price do you think he will be.
cheers


Daryl Annells
Australia
(Needs Verification)
Posts 4706
Dogs 1 / Races 0

17 Mar 2010 02:26


maybe around $1500 attila, but could be pushed out more.
dont know who would stand him, but if darren did, he's a very reasonable person and prices accordingly.
daz

ps.
if he does well in the egg on saturday, that would be an absolute positive and then i would retire him and get the promo machine going.


Mal Dawson
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 5640
Dogs 27 / Races 74

17 Mar 2010 02:50


jeff holland wrote:

The question you have to ask is 'has any sire succeeded where his breeding his a bigger attribute than his ability?.'

Jeff if you want to categorize CR well he will go to stud with better racing credentials than TOKEN PRINCE, COLLISION, WHERES PEDRO and SURF LORIAN, geez hes got to be raging success already as these are some of the best at stud in last few yrs.

To answer your question
YES



Shane Carter
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 4757
Dogs 12 / Races 0

17 Mar 2010 03:02


Mal

How can u say better credentials than TP, Collision or Surf Lorian ??.....all three a multiple Group winners/TR holders.....I'm a fan CR but what has he won????

Surf Lorian in particularly would would not only give CR windburn in ability and also in his record.....

cheers



John McAlister
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 5642
Dogs 1 / Races 0

17 Mar 2010 03:15


I would have no problem now breeding him back to hisgreat damline ..now the Import has been used....it is a proven method ..and will always be ..line breed with an Irish outcross ...it will possibly be the next generation that will come to the fore....look at Temlee ...and sires like him
I can,t do the click thing but I can do this ....Cosmic Rumble x Skipalong Suzie [1 I found on GD] ..to me that would be a nice cross...and it is something I have done before with good cuccess


Jeff Holland
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 4831
Dogs 125 / Races 12

17 Mar 2010 03:24


mal dawson wrote:

jeff holland wrote:

The question you have to ask is 'has any sire succeeded where his breeding his a bigger attribute than his ability?.'

Jeff if you want to categorize CR well he will go to stud with better racing credentials than TOKEN PRINCE, COLLISION, WHERES PEDRO and SURF LORIAN, geez hes got to be raging success already as these are some of the best at stud in last few yrs.

To answer your question
YES

Mal, Collision was a Group winner and the Wenty track record holder, Surf Lorian the Albion Pk record holder, Token Prince the winner of several Group races, and WPedro, well he did break down after 17 starts.

You'll have to find some more examples, as i dont think many will agree that CR is better performed than any of the above.


Mal Dawson
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 5640
Dogs 27 / Races 74

17 Mar 2010 03:38


Shane Carter wrote:

Mal

How can u say better credentials than TP, Collision or Surf Lorian ??.....all three a multiple Group winners/TR holders.....I'm a fan CR but what has he won????

Surf Lorian in particularly would would not only give CR windburn in ability and also in his record.....

cheers

Shane i dont think we will agree on this as i dont think wirh any prejudice and dont have favourites when looking at any dogs potential bar my own.

CR ran 29.58 at SPK beating QL, VELL, DL, L/DUCAL and TREW MILLIONS.
hE RAN 29.85 at ALBION beating HIGH EARNER
Ran fastest dog of the year 29.64 at WPK and broke the LIS 520MT T/R.
That is consistantly being able to run fast time at differant tracks something none of those other dogs were able to do outside there own state
There group wins were in either maiden class or age restricted and none performed well against open company dogs.
They all went to stud on the back of what they could have done and not actually wat they did do once again outside there own state.
Personally unbiasedly i rate HE , DL and CR on a par.....but its JMO




Mal Dawson
Australia
(Verified User)
Posts 5640
Dogs 27 / Races 74

17 Mar 2010 03:51


jeff holland wrote:

mal dawson wrote:

jeff holland wrote:

The question you have to ask is 'has any sire succeeded where his breeding his a bigger attribute than his ability?.'

Jeff if you want to categorize CR well he will go to stud with better racing credentials than TOKEN PRINCE, COLLISION, WHERES PEDRO and SURF LORIAN, geez hes got to be raging success already as these are some of the best at stud in last few yrs.

To answer your question
YES

Mal, Collision was a Group winner and the Wenty track record holder, Surf Lorian the Albion Pk record holder, Token Prince the winner of several Group races, and WPedro, well he did break down after 17 starts.

You'll have to find some more examples, as i dont think many will agree that CR is better performed than any of the above.

JEFF you rate dogs, tell me TWO OUT where do you rate COSMIC RUMBLE with dogs like

COLLISION
WHERES PEDRO
EL GALO
HIGH EARNER
SURF LORIAN
DYNA LACHLAN
TOKEN PRINCE
PURE OCTANE
HALLUCINATE
VELOCETTE
TURANZA BALE
BIT CHILI
BOMBASTIC SHIRAZ
GOODESY

or any else you care to add




Brendon Stevens
(Verified User)
Posts 5416
Dogs 8 / Races 43

17 Mar 2010 04:13


Token Prince the winner of several Group races,

>>>>>

So what are these several group races Token Prince won Jeff?

The Vince Curry...the Sandown Sapphire...that's 2...was there any more?


Daryl Annells
Australia
(Needs Verification)
Posts 4706
Dogs 1 / Races 0

17 Mar 2010 04:40


bit late to be worried about them now guys....the proof is now in the pudding with TP and all the others mentioned.
the topic is about COSMIC RUMBLE.
SOME LIKE HIM, SOME DONT.
for whatever the reasons for or against, you must admit he is a well credentialed sire(future) but hes not outstanding....a bit like all the others mentioned.
so time will tell whether hes a goodun or a baddun (shocking english i know)
daz

posts 119page  1 2 3 4 5 6