But, think about how self-evident what i'm saying is, as the only two he'd probably beat relied on early speed to win, whilst most of the others didnt. They obviously had the sheer ability or class needed to do what CR to date hasnt been able.

I'll be honest, outside of one run, and that was on a prepared track, he hasnt shown the ability to make it as a stud dog. His CONSISTENT rating is about 3/10ths off the mark. Instead of picking out one or two runs, have a look at his overall form, and the times he usually runs, as that is a more honest guide to his actual ability.

Like have a look at his first 6 runs, there is nothing there to suggest he was a stud dog, he even went out double figure odds. Then he breaks the Lismore record, but follows that with another 12 runs that dont say stud dog, until the 29.64 win at wenty.

Since then all he has done is run times that any good 3rd grader would be expected to run. There are lots of dogs that run 29.60 at Sandown or 29.85 at Albion and dont have stud careers, and quite a few that have run faster and struggle for a stud career.

If he wasnt by a 'spin' sire, and promoted by those wishing and hoping for an import to produce a sire, this would be his future at stud CLICK HERE

please tell me where my predice r with Surf Lorian?......I'm not sure if too many on here saw too much of SL race but I count myself fortunate to see him race live....if u think CR is anywhere in SL's league, then u r fooling yourself.......

As for times, CL run them in what, generally 5th grade city events and yes, he beaten some very good dogs but he's well and truely been beaten more often against them....and he couldn't win those same "maiden class or age restricted events", funny that....

a slow beginner whom runs wide, promises the world but in the end, has not achieved alot yet.....this is Jeff dream dog....if u look back at previous subjects on CR, u will note that I'm a FAN of CR....

cheers

CLICK HERE
Ahhh, those were the days. Spiral Nikita was the bookies sire of the year, devastated that he's passed on.

THIS HITS THE NAIL ON THE HEAD -
If he wasnt by a 'spin' sire, and promoted by those wishing and hoping for an import to produce a sire.

I think he is an over rated dog and as i have said before, if he was owned and trained by Mr. Joe blow, then no one would give a rats ass about him.

jeff holland wrote:

Mal, it depends where, but there are not many on that list that CR could beat two out. He'd beat DL, HE possibly, WP i never saw enough of to say. But, think about how self-evident what i'm saying is, as the only two he'd probably beat relied on early speed to win, whilst most of the others didnt. They obviously had the sheer ability or class needed to do what CR to date hasnt been able. I'll be honest, outside of one run, and that was on a prepared track, he hasnt shown the ability to make it as a stud dog. His CONSISTENT rating is about 3/10ths off the mark. Instead of picking out one or two runs, have a look at his overall form, and the times he usually runs, as that is a more honest guide to his actual ability. Like have a look at his first 6 runs, there is nothing there to suggest he was a stud dog, he even went out double figure odds. Then he breaks the Lismore record, but follows that with another 12 runs that dont say stud dog, until the 29.64 win at wenty. Since then all he has done is run times that any good 3rd grader would be expected to run. There are lots of dogs that run 29.60 at Sandown or 29.85 at Albion and dont have stud careers, and quite a few that have run faster and struggle for a stud career. If he wasnt by a 'spin' sire, and promoted by those wishing and hoping for an import to produce a sire, this would be his future at stud CLICK HERE

Dan hollywood wrote:

What criteria is there, on the track for a dog to be successful as a stud.

Theres only two sire lines really, Brother Fox and Waverley Supreme. One produces a better % of dogs while the other, bitches are producing more so than the odd sire.

Two Group wins, and TP meets the definition.

Jeff..several is more than 2, but not very many..my point being he won 2 group races...not several

indefinite doesn't mean 'i'm too lazy to push a few keys on my keyboard :-)..

indefinite = not clearly defined..

Token Princes form is clearly defined..he won 2 group races, not several, but thanks for the English and Maths lessons anyways Jeff

Cosmic Rumble may end up a super stud one day, but is probably not as good a dog at this stage on the track as Token Prince.

Lets not forgett that some unraced stud dogs have been very good, but the bottom line is that Cosmic Rumble is over rated, and I would not put a bitch to him at this stage.

Who knows he may take out the Egg, but i will have my money on something else.

Cheers :)

Brendon Stevens wrote:

jeff holland wrote: Brendon, give me a break. Several is actually ' i dont want to look up the form, so i'll give an answer which is indefinite'. indefinite doesn't mean 'i'm too lazy to push a few keys on my keyboard :-).. indefinite = not clearly defined.. Token Princes form is clearly defined..he won 2 group races, not several, but thanks for the English and Maths lessons anyways Jeff

and that BRANDEEN line would throw to the local rooster.
go for it (when its time of course)

keep an eye on a young dog who is setting the world on fire at present....EL GRAND SENOR........maybe not for your baby, but if he keeps heading in the direction he is presently, he will become the next TOPIC OF STUD CONVERSATION.
again, it will be in the future,like your girl, but always like to keep following young, fast racers as long as they do the right thing.
daz

but that should not detract from his future as a stud dog.
so well bred, and certainly a sire to utilise if people are game to try thr doubling of BRETT LEE....and why wouldnt we?

he's a great dog, but his slow boxing is what i feel people are honing in on....but we cant all have ELGALO type breakers, can we?
daz