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Spot on Paul................here's the 2x descending names mated together for easier viewing............and note the 'top female' similarities between the two closest male names............
AND......as can be adding more of the theme. Champion female 'Zulu Moss' carries similarity to 'Pitstock Park'...........bring them together and numerous 'greats' have been thrown..............like this couple.......
It makes it easier to follow the x paths when you have a champion brood bitch who breeds a stud dog who is more effective as a dam sire, like with Lemon Soda leading to Minnies Nikita and then Spiral Nikita.
And when every second ancestor is dog then bitch, the probability of that X chromosome being passed on is greater.
Doug Taylor Australia (Verified User) Posts 1896 Dogs 22 / Races 1 17 Apr 2014 23:20
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Darren John McKenzie wrote:
........you can never have too much cleverly related linebreeding.........especially to leading female names.
Totally agree Darren, personally I think those sorts of relationships are what's behind many of the 'nicks' people come to know without them realising it because it's past the first few obvious generations. The Token Prince x Just the Best nick is just one example (using JTBests sister to demonstrate)
Darren John McKenzie Australia (Verified User) Posts 507 Dogs 40 / Races 24 17 Apr 2014 23:37
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There are many of them that's for certain.
Here's a mating that could/should have been done imho ......along the same theme...........to produce some wonderfully pedigree'd daughters for future breeding........
...on face value, some could say the 'Malawi's Prince' linebreeding was the reason for its success.......others might think the 'Bay Road Queen' clever linebreeding.........culminating in the clever between 'Token Prince' & 'Flo Jo Tears' as probably the main reason..............others maybe both.........I reckon both play a huge part..........but look at this behind all that.......
I think this was the 'key' to the litter being so good overall...........depth of pedigree back a bit and in the right spots to work best.............
Arguable of course........but that's the beauty of linebreeding cleverly..................the more 'clever', the luckier some breeders get.
James Saunders Australia (Verified User) Posts 4644 Dogs 3 / Races 3 18 Apr 2014 00:00
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Darren when you outcross on T.P or vice versa you have set the line up to go to a sire line like brett lee in this case it was just done after the royal assasin in which case i believe it shortened the meterage and produced what is what meant to produce.There is no better than out cross on T.P or L.O.F before adding temlee sireline.This was classic pattern breeding and the double of malawis is simply icing.(perhaps)
Darren John McKenzie Australia (Verified User) Posts 507 Dogs 40 / Races 24 18 Apr 2014 00:09
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james saunders wrote:
Darren when you outcross on T.P or vice versa you have set the line up to go to a sire line like brett lee in this case it was just done after the royal assasin in which case i believe it shortened the meterage and produced what is what meant to produce.There is no better than out cross on T.P or L.O.F before adding temlee sireline.This was classic pattern breeding and the double of malawis is simply icing.(perhaps)
Agree.........totally, that's a further angle in the process.
It all comes down to the environment you're playing with.......and what's on offer.
Proving the equation first............whatever the outcome.........dictates the next step.............provided there's enough of an example to form a conclusion from
In the case of the 'Grizz' gamble............well proven in its environment...........creates daughters well credentialed for brood production........hopefully better than their mother.........but also creates a situation where the 'mother' can be outcrossed (hopefully cleverly) til the day she dies............and these daughters can be mated back over and over to the original sire (Over Flo).........for even better results (possibly)...
Breeding dynasties are created this way..............
James Saunders Australia (Verified User) Posts 4644 Dogs 3 / Races 3 18 Apr 2014 00:13
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If any one new too breeding and are looking for that broodie you could do alot worse than finding an outcrossed bitch with her grandam out of token prince or vice versa but getting rarer now T.P bitches.Because the line is so open to breed on with now the hard work and waiting was done by someone else.What thats got to do with lemon soda not much.
Darren John McKenzie Australia (Verified User) Posts 507 Dogs 40 / Races 24 18 Apr 2014 00:19
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james saunders wrote:
If any one new too breeding and are looking for that broodie you could do alot worse than finding an outcrossed bitch with her grandam out of token prince or vice versa but getting rarer now T.P bitches.Because the line is so open to breed on with now the hard work and waiting was done by someone else.What thats got to do with lemon soda not much.
It's all an extension to the 'Lemon Soda' angle James...............why things might be working like they do.............nearly always because of more than just 1x duplicated name in a mix.
Many many things at work in a winner................cheers
Ryan Vanderwert Australia (Verified User) Posts 5958 Dogs 8 / Races 0 18 Apr 2014 00:34
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james saunders wrote:
.....There is no better than out cross on T.P or L.O.F before adding temlee sireline.This was classic pattern breeding.....
Bearability in that mix ?
;)
Tom Welsh Australia (Verified User) Posts 2112 Dogs 67 / Races 11 18 Apr 2014 00:36
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Good Friday was made for mindless pedigree work I reckon Ryan :-)
Ryan Vanderwert Australia (Verified User) Posts 5958 Dogs 8 / Races 0 18 Apr 2014 00:40
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haha Tom, but some guess the ped and pray on Good Fri.
very much a breeding parallel to Maturity winner Rocka Cocatoo exposing JTB's, Credibility's & Worth Doing's damlines, and with a successful primary linebreeding intensity in x through littermates, you give yourself half a chance.
Edward (Ted) Howard Australia (Verified User) Posts 1195 Dogs 16 / Races 0 18 Apr 2014 09:53
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Hi Ryan I mentioned this litter before but did not get a response Cosmic Rumble-Winklee weeper which I think fits your criteria first time on the drag this week went really good one went like a seasoned race dog IMO. Cheers Ted.P.S. with the amount of stars on the click here this thread is akin to being in a thunderstorm and takes a lot away from the thread.
Ryan Vanderwert Australia (Verified User) Posts 5958 Dogs 8 / Races 0 18 Apr 2014 12:21
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Apologies Ted for not getting back.
Wld love to claim your litter but the sire side is not in x to Lemon Soda (the damside is), however that litter of yours do linebreed back as a primary intensity in x to cornerstone brood Elsie Moss(at a quick glance), and that's a huge plus. Generally 500m sees them out but they do have some quality over that trip. btw you've done really well with your sire choice too as it creates a breeding parallel to Bomber's a Flyer.
All the very best with them.
ps. thunderstorms only wreck things temporarily, quality always rises to the top.
Grant Thomas Australia (Verified User) Posts 11447 Dogs 64 / Races 20 18 Apr 2014 13:04
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Ryan Vanderwert wrote:
james saunders wrote:
.....There is no better than out cross on T.P or L.O.F before adding temlee sireline.This was classic pattern breeding.....
Do you have questions about breeding theories? 
